Debating the debates

Posted: Thursday, Oct 09, 2008 - 02:59:31 pm PDT

Candidates duel in historical matchups

Two people, two microphones, one moderator and dynamic history in the making. This is what debates should be.

America faces one of two historical firsts with this election. We could have our first African-American president or our first female vice president. It all depends on us as voters.

When senators John McCain and Barack Obama first debated Sept. 26, roughly 52.4 million Americans (according to Nielson ratings) tuned in to watch and be swayed by what the candidates said.

Afterward, we continued talking about their performances, discussed their answers and pondered their meanings, as we took an active role in this historical election.

As vice presidential candidates Sen. Joe Biden and Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin discussed the issues and their presidential running mates' platforms, 69.9 million of us watched and listened.

A second round of presidential debates Tuesday allowed 63.2 million of us to take part again in determining who our next president will be. We listened to what both senators had to say about each other and their plans of the future of the United States.

The number of people watching is impressive. It shows hope that the public is going to vote based on the candidates' platforms instead of post-debate spun stories or television segments filled with bias.

National television continues to show who they favor. It's not hard to see. We're amazed when one candidate is vilified for doing the same thing their opponent was cheered on for.

Long before the party candidates were confirmed, former CBS anchorman Dan Rather presented a look at election coverage in a cable channel special. It was disheartening to see one young reporter, who only voted in one presidential election, proclaim he was an expert and a fair, unbiased observer.

The young man apparently forgot to remove the Obama sticker from his laptop before the interview.

Look at the amount of news about a Saturday Night Live (SNL) sketch proclaiming Tina Fey as the greatest actress/comedienne for her parody of Palin. There was barely a mention of her male counter-part for his equally skilled comedic version of Biden.

"Fey's Palin re-ignites 'SNL' politics," WDIV television news, Detroit

"As Tina Fey soars, Sarah Palin struggles," Washington (D.C.) Times

"In this election, 'SNL' wins," St. Petersburg (Fla.) Times

Yes, the television comedy show did win. They received far more coverage than the sketch should have. There was more national attention for it than when the same show featured Al Gore being electrocuted by a stun gun in preparation for a kiss with his wife Tipper in 2002.

Regardless of the pundits, experts, analysts and consultants all receiving air time to spin for their favorite candidate or party, it is refreshing to see a large number of voters taking time to see the candidates in action for themselves.

Why wait for someone to explain why you should vote for Obama or McCain, when you could watch them discuss their plans for the future and decide for yourself?

It will be a wonderful historic event when we have our first female vice president or African-American president.

It will be a complete victory when they are voted in for their stands on the issues not the spin of commentators or comedians.

- Editorial board

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* All comment posts will encounter a possible delay of up to 24 hours.

Heathen wrote on Oct 16, 2008 2:02 PM:

" Jim, I'm not sure what you mean by that. In this discussion we're looking at questions of media bias, and whether Obama is a citizen. I haven't seen anyone blaming Republicans for anything except the accusations that Obama isn't a citizen. For the record, I don't blame Republicans for all of the mess we're in. Both parties supported deregulation and allowed stupid policies within financial organizations based on greed. However, at present it's clear that McCain continues to support deregulation and will do little to stop these stupid policies within financial organizations. All his talk about "earmarks" will not solve the problem. I see nothing that will aside from additional governmental regulations on financial transactions. "

Jim wrote on Oct 16, 2008 1:08 PM:

" Funny how everyone wants to blame republicans for what is wrong with us! Just curious though...who is control of the House and Senate, you know the ones who are supposed to be representing us and our views and makeing the decisions. I have thought it was the Dems.... "

John McRandall wrote on Oct 16, 2008 12:32 PM:

" I dont think it can be said much better than what wwn has stated....redistribution of wealth, property...its marxist...Not American... "

Heathen wrote on Oct 16, 2008 11:56 AM:

" WWN, you need to listen more carefully. First off, unless you're making over $250K a year, YOU will be the one benefiting financially from Obama's plan. Google it and see. As to the land--it isn't "held by private enterprise oil companies." It's public land with drilling rights leased by these oil companies. You need to get your facts straight if you're going to make this kind of argument. No one is talking about taking away property. They're talking about making sure that oil companies stop buying up leases just to keep the oil out of circulation so the prices will stay high. "

wwn wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:42 AM:

" The "change" Obama always talks about is not what we want for this country. When anyone wants to take our HARD EARNED money, and "spread the wealth around" to those people, who CHOOSE to collect, collect, collect from government programs instead of working for a living, is a pure socialist. Right now, we have a choice in this country to sit on our rears and watch TV all day, or go out and make a difference. How many people will take to the couch if their hard work won't benefit anyone but those already sitting on the couch? Joe the plumber doesn't like it, and neither do I. Let's examine the statement Obama made about the 67 million acres of land held by PRIVATE enterprise oil companies. He wants to promote "USE it or LOSE it", inferring that if they don't drill on their land, he will take the land away from them? This mentality will trickle down to all private property owners and goes against real estate principles that we all have a right to "do nothing at all with our own property", if we so choose. Already, in another country, foreign president Morales has taken steps to remove property ownership from landowners and "redistribute" land ownership to the poor. How long will it take Obama to do the same with the views he has? We must all look to the issues and not to who has the eloquent talk. McCain will move to change our great nation BACK to what it once was that made it great. THE PEOPLE and private property ownership! Obamas' associations and convictions are socialist and marxist and unfortunately we will all find out the hard way if we elect him for his smooth talking mannerism. More of our freedom will be lost forever and property ownership rights will be dust in the wind. "

Heathen wrote on Oct 16, 2008 7:25 AM:

" This ploy by the Republicans is completely transparent. They create an accusation against Obama which is of a personal nature, they claim that the candidate isn't complying with their "investigation" and they continue to spread rumors. If I were to do the same on the part of the Democrats, it would look something like this:

"I read somewhere that McCain actually has a long red tail like Satan. If you look closely in some of the pictures, you can see a line along the back of his pants that looks exactly like Satan's tail. He hasn't denied the accusation, so I wonder what he's hiding. Why hasn't be posted photos of himself in the nude to the internet, so that he can disprove this accusation?"

You see how it works? Kind of crazy if you ask me. "

Glenn Sand wrote on Oct 16, 2008 4:40 AM:

" If one can find humor in this situation it would have to be the Republicans, known for their stock-in-trade of fear mongering, ringing the bell of alarm about the dreaded possibility (probability, actually) of a Democratic POTUS while controlling both Houses of Congress. Yeah, that would be something, especially after we've seen what the exact opposite has wrought on us in 6 of the past 8 years. We have all seen what the Democratically controlled government of the Clinton years did to us and we surly don't want another 8 years of peace, prosperity, and budget surpluses, huh? The ultimate Republican bogeyman...lol!

I just hope the object lesson here is the high cost of staying home on election day and wasting your vote which so many have fought and died for your right to cast. Hopefully, a few more people will see the value of voting and as a direct result, we will see a government that is more responsive to the wants and needs of the electorate...but, I doubt it.

By the way, the Grant County Auditor's office assured me yesterday that the absentee ballots for the upcoming election are going out in Friday's mail. I can't wait!! "

Heathen wrote on Oct 15, 2008 4:18 PM:

" Socialist? Wait--those are the guys who think the government should buy up all the banks and all the houses of people in debt, right? Aren't they represented by an elephant?

Obama's no socialist, and the fact that you make this charge and indulge in other name-calling shows that you're more interested in stirring up the pot than in legitimate debate.

The Kenya thing? A story supported by four right-wing conspiracist newspapers and a couple of scandal rags. And you believe it? Why? What makes the word of a grandmother in Kenya more believable than the scanned document that appeared on the internet, proving that he was born in Honolulu Hawaii? Politifact.com has verified it. The Hawaii Department of Health has verified it. Those who continue to question it are clutching at straws, and will fail. I'm telling you, the McCain supporters are desperate at this point. Their stubborn refusal to let go of this point when they have clearly lost simply proves how out of touch they are. "

Carl wrote on Oct 15, 2008 2:32 PM:

" Time will tell whether he actually is a US citizen..two different hospitals are listed as his birth place...family says he was born in Kenya..Obama is fighting the release of the records? Why? Would be rather easy mess to clear up, you would think.....As for his politics...well its been said below, the man is a Socialist and that isnt the foundation this country was built upon...His lack of leadership experience is a huge obstacle IMO...While McCain isnt my dream canidate...atleast he was trained to lead and Palin as Gov of Alaska, basically runs a large country in itself...Either candidate is pledged to more deficeit spending, the only difference is which lobbist is paying them to sell us out..big business, Unions, foriegn interests....Our choice is who will do the least damage to the American Ideal....McCain is my choice...I never did care for Communists anyways...... "

Heathen wrote on Oct 15, 2008 11:55 AM:

" Well Carl, that would make a whole lot of difference IF OBAMA WAS BORN OUTSIDE OF THE US. In fact, he was born in Hawaii a couple of years after it was admitted as a state, and his mother was a US citizen, so his father's nationality doesn't matter. The law is clear. If you're dealing with a child born outside of the US, these things matter, but with Obama they don't.

I also think it's sad that folks can't attack his political views, so they try to make him out to be a "dangerous outsider." As I pointed out, this attack works far better when describing McCain than it does when attacking Obama--a native-born US citizen born to a mother who was also a US citizen. "

Chris wrote on Oct 14, 2008 10:17 PM:

" Lol right on, Glenn and Heathen. "

Carl wrote on Oct 14, 2008 9:48 PM:

" The Panama Canal Zone was American soil, when McCain was born their and both of his parents were US citizens, father was US military...Kenya is not nor has it ever been and only one of Obamas parents was a US citizen at the time ..... "

Glenn Sand wrote on Oct 14, 2008 5:29 PM:

" Point, set, match...Heathen. You have to feel a little bit sorry for the 'Joe six-pack' Max's of the world. They don't think too clearly 30 minutes or so after they get home from work and all they really can think of to say is what they heard down at the local pub from one of their buddies who can actually read or read on the restroom wall in a stall at work. "

Heathen wrote on Oct 14, 2008 4:14 PM:

" Gee whiz, Max. That's really helpful. If we made legal decisions based on every time somebody's grandma got confused we'd be in great shape, wouldn't we? Remove the slanders and lies from your post and what's left?

Diddly-squat.

Now, how about those nasty foreigners born in the Panama Canal Zone? I say we do everything we can to keep them out of office. "

Max wrote on Oct 14, 2008 12:52 PM:

" Obama/Biden...Socialism/communism at its finest...Even his Grandmother says he was born in Kenya, apparently born in two different hospitals in hawaii..which is it? NoObama...we dont want a PolPot/Stalin/Castro commie government here thanks..... "

Heathen wrote on Oct 14, 2008 9:43 AM:

" I'm surprised at how much gender plays into things, both to the detriment and the advancement of candidates. I'm trying my best to imagine a man with the credentials and speaking skills of Sarah Palin making it past the earliest vetting stages for VP selection, but I just can't see it. Visions of Dan Quayle on Thorazine dance in my head. Some think it's refreshing to see a female politician who speaks her mind regardless of the repercussions. However, a male politician who does the same is generally doomed to be compared to Hugo Chavez. "

Pablo wrote on Oct 14, 2008 8:44 AM:

" I recall reading somewhere that McCain stated something to the effect of; the debates weren't very important because if you happen to be a poor denater then you lose, and we should focus on the issues. Funny that nobody can even give a decent concrete statement about the issues, for fear of angering one of the many factions of their own party, and thus losing credibility. Everything has to be candy coated, and stated in such a vague, noncommitted manner that many of us have no idea WHAT to think the candidates stand for. Then of course there's the out and out lies and misrepresentations of facts being plastered in my mail box, on my radio and TV. Sad state of affairs... very sad indeed. "

Glenn Sand wrote on Oct 13, 2008 5:51 PM:

" The real "victory" will come when we quit taking note of the age, gender, ethnicity and religion of our candidates for public office. That we dwell on such trivial things says volumes about our society. We aren't nearly as advanced, sophisticated and civilized, as we would like to believe. In fact, we are quite primitive. We have yet to progress to the point beyond which our prejudices and inner fears guide our thinking and actions. To quote Adolph Hitler..."What good fortune for governments that people do not think." "

Capable reader wrote on Oct 13, 2008 10:05 AM:

" HA ha ha! I read the editorial as meaning the debates were a great way to make up your mind yourself. "

Chris wrote on Oct 12, 2008 6:37 PM:

" Can you please clarify your opinion, "opinionated?" I'd like to know which of your agendas wasn't spun the way you wanted. It's obvious you have some kind of grudge. "

opinionated wrote on Oct 11, 2008 4:22 PM:

" How ironic to read an article in THIS newspaper complaining about bias in the media. "

Heathen wrote on Oct 11, 2008 8:59 AM:

" I watched the debates and the commentaries afterward on CNN. They did their best to be balanced. Reporters who were expected to be non-partisan did a good job. When they went into partisan commentary, they had both Democrat and Republican commentators. What we need to determine here is whether the appearance of bias simply comes about because McCain isn't doing as well as Obama. Consider the debates. If you watched bipartisan viewer response, it was clear that McCain's approach was unpopular. CNN's Republican commentators acknowledged that McCain did poorly in the debate. Perhaps you'd get a different report of outcome from Fox, but I don't think anyone thinks of Fox as a balanced reporter of the news. Has Fox ever brought in Democrats to balance out their coverage? Not to my knowledge. Fox on one side, Huffington Post on the other, and CNN et al. in the middle.

If we want to discuss trivial things that were over-hyped by the media, how about Obama's flag pin? It cuts both ways. "

Sir Logical wrote on Oct 10, 2008 6:13 PM:

" The SNL sketch was funny. All the actors were good. Why is Palin being singled out? She's far better on 30 Rock at Liz Lemon. But the Herald has a point. The sketch was overhyped by media and does make me wonder why.

I like the point we have the debates to feed us info on who to vote for. Not national media. Not television "experts." Not bloggers who have obvious agendas. "

Heathen wrote on Oct 9, 2008 10:38 PM:

" Oh Puh-Leeeeze. That old "liberal media" thing again? Regarding SNL, you don't even know the name of the guy who did the Biden impersonation. Why? It wasn't very good. Fey does a good Palin impersonation, and Palin is actually using this to boost her campaign. It's no conspiracy. Just good comedy.

As to the bias in the media coverage of the debates, you'll have to be more specific. Was it perhaps the bias shown when only a few media outlets pointed out that McCain doesn't know an overhead projector from a planetarium projector, or that he's completely uninformed about whether certain earmarks actually passed?

Could you explain what it is that one candidate was vilified for while another was cheered for the same thing? I don't seem to recall that. What I remember from the debates was that McCain simply didn't perform as well as Obama, largely due to his insistence on personal attacks and innuendo. Pointing that out isn't bias. It's just a valid observation. "

Glenn Sand wrote on Oct 9, 2008 3:39 PM:

" It will be a wonderful historic event when we have our first female vice president or African-American president.

I fail to see what's so wonderful about it other than the McSame/Palin ticket make it a no-brainer (pun intended) for whom to vote for. You couldn't have chosen more mediocre candidates for the Republican ticket in this election. I can't imagine the ridicule that would befall anyone publically admitting that they voted for that pair of losers.

I hate to say it outloud, but the 300 lb gorilla in the room is the fear that when the dust settles, we'll see Joe Biden finishing out the term so rightfully won by Barack Obama. That's an event I don't even want to live to see. "

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Debating the debates